Nooks and Crannies

Well I would like to learn more about the origins of the Predators, that's always caught my attention.

Maybe not in a movie but I'd like to know a little more.

I'd have to agree with darklioness on this one.

Origins of the Preds no doubt.

Hey long time no see Waralien, how've you been?


Anywho back on-topic: I would also like to get a deeper understanding of the culture of the Predators(hunting, hierarchy, beliefs ect) as well not just simply their origins.

I've been good, started my last year in college.

Anywho, I think I read somewhere about one of their rituals, something about how the young unblooded warriors braided their hair?

Well I wish you the best of luck :)

Yeah I read about the braiding process somewhere in Aliens vs Predator: Hunter's planet but it was only mentioned once so my understanding of that particular ritual isn't as clear as I'd like it to be.

Well basically what everyone else is saying. We've already taken a peak at the origins of the Xenomorph but we haven't taken much of a look at the origins or life of the Predators.

It'd be wonderful to know whether or not the wrist contraptions act like artificial limbs. The Plasma Caster is said to work like that, so the Wristblades being like that would be kinda cool.

Agreed Bloo


I would also like to see family interactions, you know "Life outside the Hunt", just because a predator is a great hunter doesn't mean he cant be a family man too.

I think more information on the relation between predator society and the technology they use would be interesting. What I mean is that the mask, the plasmacaster, the wristblades, the smart disk, all seem to be controlled through a wireless connection to the predator's brain, functioning, as Bloo put it, like artificial limbs. Either that, or they're controlled through voice commands. Every combination of ticks and clicks the predator makes could actually be a voice command.

Anyway, this is very advanced technology and it would be interesting to find out how a species that seems to still be in the tribal stages of social development managed to get such technology. Were they once a highly developed society and then something happened that brought them back tribalism, or are some of them so good at hunting that they managed to steal this technology from another species?

The Predators we've seen might even just be a small percentage of the planet's (assuming they only have one planet) population, that percentage being the most tribal and "traditional."

Or their iq and eq are sorta fucked up. Like me! I got plenty brains, but put me as president it's Lord of the Flies.

I did put a lot of time into this post so I simply ask y'all to read it, I promise you it will make you stop and think, might even blow your mind, so just... give it a chance...

I just realised that made it sound like a Spam advertisement...

Continuing support of Dark Lioness, I'd like to know more about the Preadtors, obviously.

And to add to Death Wraith's point you may be right. We have all read at the very least in AvP2's Human campaign that the majority of the equipment is linked into the nervous system and the neural functions of the body, so much so that "attempt at removal of [said equipment] would cause instant death".

This also brings back up an old point of mine about just how much about these creatures has been lost, seemingly from the very start of their respective sequels and to this day have never been realised and remembered.

Let me begin with the Xeno seeing as how we're primarily on the topic of Yautja at the moment I'll get to that last because most likely you guys will only remember (or read for that matter) the last paragraph of this post...

In the first Alien film only a single "Face-Hugger" emerged from the egg stasis chamber upon Kain(?) entering and basically disturbing the peace. This Face-Hugger latched onto him busting through his helmet with ease and remained latched on him for quite some time, breathing into his throat to keep him alive. Once it had removed itself it managed to hide before its death (and due to how the whole scenario played out we have no idea how long it was alive after detaching itself. Could be like a Bee a die in a matter of seconds? or maybe it survives for a little bit.)

Face-Huggers alone, things such as AvP2010 game have made your human character capable of blocking the Face-Hugger's attack with a single hand, and in almost any add-on to the Alien and/or AvP series has Face-Huggers only attached for seemingly a few minutes (and dying presumeably directly after detachment) as such "Chest-Bursters" emerging within seconds (as opposed to quite some time later like in Alien). (Both of these facts about time represented in the AvP film itself.) Obviously the Face-Hugger in "Alien" has been in stasis for quite some time and that could have affected it.

The fact of a Chest-Burster Molting in a very short time still remains, but upon Showing of the full-grown Xeno many other traits have been forgotten. Primarily being its humanoidal behavior. A lot of this could be blamed on "Aliens" (Which I consider almost just as much canon as the first) but the Insect-like Behavior has taken over. Obviously it has a lot to do with the simple time the film was made, but if that's when it was made then that's how it'll forever be. The Xenomorph in Alien was tall, and stood upon its hind legs (as opposed to always being on all fours like in games and AvP) and moved slow (unlike being lightning fast in modern adaptations, but this was all at least whenever it was actually visible which was only before it killed someone, also it was young.) and some of the fear shown in the film has to do with the subject of rape (especially due to the killing of the other girl on the ship whom I cannot remember the name) as it slowly trailed its forward-pointing tail up the inside of her leg and after she "dies" all we see of her is her completely naked legs hanging from something.

And then in Aliens it showed the concept of an Alien hive, and yes the Xenomorphs moved slightly faster and maybe a bit more bug-like, but especially think of when it stood up behind Newt, they were huge, and almost humanoid. Plus the ripples and ridges on their heads are NEVER explained as being another "breed" or "type" of Alien. I hate when games or even fans (like on here) say that it is, they have simply been around longer, a little older, maybe more mature. As such we have no idea how long they live. Why was the Alien acting so weird and tired at the end of the first film? What makes them tick? What do they truly need to survive and how long exactly DO they survive? Maybe he was dying due to the different climate? everyone assumes that they can just breathe our air. Which Ash in the first film may very well be right, that it's able to simply adapt but, just how well? Everyone sits there and thinks that Xenomorphs are all over the Galaxy and could take over and rule. And are always asking about their "Homeworld". As far as I know from the first two films, they are natives of LV-1204, that IS their homeworld, and as far as I know is the only planet they are on. Just like how we Humans are from Earth, they are from there. Maybe that's where the Predators got the Queen for AvP? Maybe LV-1204 is where they hunt them? seems legitimate to me.

I will touch back on my main points at the end of this post. Let me get to the Yautja first:

Yautja: Tall, strong, unstoppable beings. They have everything we wish we had. Size, Strength, Brains, Skill, advanced weapons and technology, and a level of Badass only Ryu Hayabusa has topped. Yet so many things have changed over time. Despite how I considder the only Canon Alien films to be Alien 1 & 2, I really do think all three Predator films are canon. In fact maybe Alien 3 was Canon I just think that for Canon's Sake we should only REALLY look at Alien 1 & 2, and Predator 1. (Give me shit but also AvP 1 to a slight extent)

It was clear that the Shoulder-Mounted Plasma Caster could be controlled without an initial Control System and that fact still remains (other than some games requiring the Predator the press a button on his wrist computer to fire the thing) but the fact that he could move, and fire, his Plasma-Caster by simply standing there has for the most part stayed, along with the automatic Wristblades. Which other than just to look cool, the Yautja seemed to clench his fist to extend, this may have just been for theatrics but it at least shows that it requires a Nervous Command. So we know the equiptment is linked up to the Nervous system and in Domino Effect, his Brain. But are they Vocally Controlled?

Something I missed greatly about the Predator that has severly been lost since Film 1 is simply its personality. Which this touches base with the voice commands just listen. Any more the Predators are all very Mammal-like. Their "Tusks" (As SOME people call them, when originally they are meant to be MANDIBLES, totally different concept) are loose, big, slow moving, and Beast-Like. With a full set of teeth and almost 100% Caucasian-Human Skin tone across the face (which is no longer that creepy oily look, now it's like a dry human skin). NO! Originally these things were far more Scary and less "Badass". Their faces were stern, and designed, their eyes dark and almost un-seeable due to the texture of their skin. Their upper teeth? "Jungle Hunter" only had TWO! which gives a very different feel then a full row of them. Their MANDIBLES were tight, thin, sharp, that clicking noise they make? some of them are made by these Mandibles! You see his upper-right Mandible twitch and vibrate against his other Mandibles, making the sound. It's a very important part of their physical features! and it's LOST by these big burly beast tusks.

Also the sounds themselves, anymore it's all growls, snarls, roars. Yes, Predator 1 had these sounds, but for the most part? He barely did, it was all these clicks and those almost sexual Purrs. Those are never heard anymore except when a Yautja is hiding in a tree and trying to intimidate someone, no in Predator 1 he did this almost constantly, which may be because he's controlling his equiptment: You'de be talking non-stop too, "switch to Heat-Vision, Lock on to Human in front, Zoom In, okay... scan object in hand... lethal weapon... zoom out, scan horizon for other prey, zoom back to normal focus, cloaking system on." See why it would be constant? And if you doubt me, re-watch the film, the end scene when he is chasing Dutch through the forest, listen close, behind all the music, listen very close, that Yautja is clicking like Crazy! It's a non-stop reflex action. Maybe just breathing creates this sound by the air-flow making the Mandibles vibrate against each-other. He's going nuts in that scene so it's safe to say that is what's causing his clicking to be out-of-control.

These things completely change the entire personality of the Predator. From it being this Master-Hunter, scary Alien species with advanced technology. With almost a bug-like face (moreso than the Xenomorphs) making clicks and Purrs, a stern serious face, and a persona and skill that made Arnold Schwarzenegger crawl away in Mercy. Watching that chase scene and looking behind Dutch at the Predator and some of the little movements and poses it strikes, and the expressions and roars, it was freightening, truly a mass of terror, JUST like when that Xeno STOOD-UP behind Newt. But now everyone wants them to be the big, bulky, strong, badass "Warriors" instead of the scary, intelligent Hunters.

In short these two beings have been lost. One of them was once a Terrifying Monster, confusing and unknown, residing on another world that we were foolish enough to tread. A single one of these was Fear Embodied. Every fear we have growning up: being alone, lost, The darkness, the non-understandable, other species, confusion, sex, slime, blood, Insects, even family, and things inside us that we don't understand or want just waiting to come out... Standing Tall and almost ghoulish it was the thing we'd have nightmares about for years. Watching this thing arise would make us scream for the few seconds we didnt know we had left...

Now they're a bunch of little black bugs crawling at us that die in a single bullet like the Goombas from Mario of the AvP Universe.

And the other was once the thing we looked over our shoulders for. An unknown being from another world... that Hunted us. We were game to these things. A single one would take out Armies of our race, with ease, as a mere youngling test. It was made to kill us, and nothing would stop it. We'd walk down our street at night going home from a midnight stroll-and-a-smoke and every little sound we'd hear would make us flinch, stop... turn around with our mouths open as we dumbfoundedly mouth-breathe. We'd look forward and think we saw something move on top of that house and we'd freeze. These things didn't just hunt us in a film, or in the theater... this thing Hunted our Psyche... Our daily lives. Made us fear the one thing Humans fear the most, the unknown, we fear most what we don't understand, and it would grasp that fear and use it against us...

Now they're a bunch of Dog's we see once as we fight them as a boss mid-game and the rest of the time we cheer them on going "Yeah!!! That was fucking AWESOME!!!"

Have I made my point? If I were to make an AvP game or Film... these fuckers are going back to being scary, like they were once famous for, now they're a cult-following! They were some of the scariest films of the time, THE scariest of Sci-Fi. And anymore they're just... "cool"... we no longer see an Alien as freightening but just as "another one of the billions in the game"... we no longer see a Predator as terrifying... but just as "The Badass side-character"... Alien is regarded as one of the GREATEST HORROR FILMS OF ALL TIME... now they aren't even scary. They're push-overs... They're "meh"... And Predator is known as THE HORROR of Sci-Fi (other than Alien), our mothers shivered at the sight of it's face... now they're just badasses on our Desktop wallpapers...

Come on guys... We don't even know these Characters anymore... They've been forgotten and lost...

And I'm sick of it.

...Thoughts and/or Opinions?

I have to disagree with you Hunter_Predator
they haven't been forgotten.

I noticed that the predators seen in the first AVP film had four upper teeth and it disturbed me, how could they make such a mistake? All the predators in all the other films had two upper teeth, come on!

And I agree with predator 34, they aren't forgotten, not yet.

The Xeno's have gone farther down hill than the Yautja, though I do find that I like them in a semi good guy role, but not as muscle bound bozo's. But films where the Yautja and Xeno's are scary are good, though I would like to see(by "see" I mean direct) a film from the point of view of a Yautja.

I hope that they can bring back the terror inducing creatures that made millions pull the covers over their heads at night.

Though personally I never had that reaction to them, I'm only scared of things that can harm me that I cant harm back, like ghosts scare the shit out of me for that reason.

I see your point and agree with it somewhat, it is a great point in fact! Scary is as scary does until Fox decides to cluster fuck them.

@dronehive

lord of the dead flies really...

I have a few qualms with the above post written by Predator_Hunter, but also just as many agreements. The xenomorphs aren't scary anymore; yeah, it's really sad. But I'm not sure anything you said actually relates to this thread, well, no some of it does but mostly it seems to be an awful lot of repressed moop. It's okay I also have plenty of repressed moop and I could bitch all day that the alien franchise went sideways and became a laughable bullshit blood and guts, gore fest, I've said it before and I'll say it again. "suspense is dead". As for predator’s faces I really didn’t like scar from AVP, he looked a bit derpy, too... Meh, cushy and congenial looking, otherwise I really couldn’t care much how many teeth they each have, two, four, full rows, don’t care. We as humans each look different, I don’t expect each yautja to be a carbon copy of the first and for all we know the one in “Predator” maybe had the teeth upfront knocked out in brawls or whatever. My point is that we haven’t been provided with enough information through the movies (which are the only legitimately canological resources from which to draw official fact about them) to make any assumptions of any kind about what they should look like naturally, whether they are a sexually dimorphic species, or how their tech works. To be honest I like the mystery and room for viewer interpretation in the case of the predators, I don’t think the movies SHOULD reveal too much about them, it will kill their magic if they do.- There, have my moop.


~~ADDED AFTER PROOFREADING THIS ABOMINATION~~

I want to learn more about the xenomorphs, where they come from and what pressures they may have encountered wherever they originated from... I want to explore the environmental pressures they may have faced before coming into contact with either humans or yautja. we can leave it at that if you aren’t in the mood to read miles of the crap that comes out of my head.

I warn you now; the rest of this post will mostly consist of me babbling on forever about crap that relates to the point but isn’t exactly about it. Get a good look people, this is how you identify a some forms of madness in text.

By the way I’m shit at proofreading so have fun.

~~

Back on point, I often ponder on the xenomorphs as they were the first thing that scared the pants off me as a kid and I always want to know more about them, namely what natural forces kept them in check wherever they came from. Yes, I saw "Prometheus"; No, that does not prove to me that the "engineers" created xenomorphs. I didn't like that movie much, the synthetic David was the only thing that saved it for me. We could talk all day about my opinions on that film as well but that would simply be an even bigger pile of moop than any one of us could handle right now.

Let us start here; to understand where I am going with this we need to understand eusocial animals like ants. We will also need to touch on snakehead fish, Asian carp, and the invasive species problem in Florida thanks to the pet trade.

I like to think of our favorite slimy black beasts this way -as a eusocial creature- something akin to a colony of ants. Ants, bees, termites etc are eusocial, Eusociality is a term used for the highest level of organization of animal sociality. Eusociality is characterized by cooperative brood care, overlapping adult generations and division of labor by reproductive and non-reproductive groups which means their behavior and day to day routines revolve around the over all good of their colony and its queen.

Single individuals that cannot reproduce will often still behave this way and gather food for an enormous writhing mass of sisters even when neither they nor a queen is present because it is hardwired into their very nature (Linking to aliens, the drone in the first film was not killing all of the people on the Nostromo, it kept a few alive in the bowls of the ship as if hoarding food for sisters or bodies for face huggers that were not present. This may be a clip only available in some collectors additions of the film.).

Odorous ant workers have been observed laying eggs when a queen isn't present though they often eat the eggs immediately after; while this seems to be a useless thing to do from an evolutionary standpoint (being that producing an egg steals away precious energy even if it is unfertilized), it hints at an ancestor that may have been able to reproduce without a queen. (Like we assume Xenos can eventually do by molting into a queen/evolving/whatever, there are a million interpretations of that.)

Looking at everything we have learned about Xenomorphs through the movies (some better than others), the books and the comics I think we can all agree that they share a few very basic traits with ants, they depend on a queen to reproduce in mass, the queen is number one priority, finding food through whatever means necessary is the next most important priority alongside egg/larvae care.


Now lets talk about invasive, not native species. I think we have all heard of and seen those videos of people in boats getting pelted by fish flying every which way on the Mississippi, there was a lot of hype about it a few years ago and for good reason. These fish are invaders from Asia, filter feeders that are literally sucking the life out of the ecosystem along the river, Asian carp filter all the nutrients out of the water, leaving hardly anything for native vegetarian fish species to subsist on, they have no natural predators here in the states and they breed at a breakneck pace.

Snake head fish are similar to the asian carp though a little different, they produce thousands of fry and then both parents protect them but the big difference between snakehead and asian carp is this; the snakehead is carnivorous, it will eat anything it can fit down its gullet, what can’t go down in one gulp gets chewed apart to hork down in pieces. Sometimes snakehead fish attack for no reason other than their highly developed prey drive, they will snap at anything that moves and have few predators outside of their natural environment. Where snakeheads came from is a much more competitive environment which makes their highly developed parental care drive essential to continue their species; here in the states it means they are reproducing out of control and taking over.

Exotic snakes have become a problem in Florida along side the snakehead fish, they have invaded the everglades and are currently at the stage of hostile occupation. They are excellent survivors and the everglades provide the ideal environment to feed, breed, soak in the water, bask in the sun and drive out all native species in competition with them; they have even been observed swallowing small alligators whole (and by small gators I mean nearly four feet long!). The rock pythons, boa constrictors, ball pythons and a plethora of other imported serpents simply don’t belong there, it is a common theory that they were introduced accidentally through the course of several cases of property damage as a result of a few different hurricanes over the las ten years. Long story short a few exotic snake breeder’s homes were destroyed in the super storms, blown over and the surviving snakes escaped into the magical land of xanthe. (Anyone who got that reference gets a cookie and my instantaneous respect for getting through those nutty books.)

What do all of these creatures have in common with xenomorphs? They invaded an ecosystem/planet/enviornment where they are not native and took over because the the predators and natural pressures to limit their ability to multiply didn’t exist there. Xenomorphs while fast, dangerous, and parasitic aren’t so different from any other invasive species.

Back to the ants. There is a species known as cordyceps which I find compelling me to write this whole long ridiculous yarn; those that have seen the nature documentary miniseries “Planet Earth” may find the name Ophiocordyceps very familiar. It was featured in a segment about jungle ants which are hugely successful organisms both in the jungle and in our own back yards. Ants populate every continent and island on the planet with the exception of antarctica but despite their obvious and indisputable success they have their enemies, a mortal foe in act; a humble (although deceivingly ruthless) parasitic fungus named Ophiocordyceps. The spores attach to the exoskeleton of the ant and invade its’ body, first taking control of the brian and driving the ant up to grip the middle vein of a leaf at the precisely perfect height and location to grow into mature fungi within the ant, but more importantly the perfect place to release its spore to infect more ants later on. The ant soon dies as it’s infected body succumbs to the growing parasite and finally the fruiting body of the cordyceps erupts from the head of the ant, growing into a stalk and eventually spreading it’s spore.

Don’t believe me? here are a few links to a a brief video about the fungi on youtube and another more deeply informative article about the same fungus which produces quote “zombie ants”.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuKjBIBBAL8

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2013/09/absurd-creature-of-the-week-zombie-ant-fungus/

The entire point of my absurdly long post and incessant rambling about ecological disasters led to this next simple and miniscule question (unbelievably). Wouldn’t it be marvelous to find out that -wherever the xenomorphs come from- a fungus much like cordyceps (but specializing in xenos) is responsible for keeping the numbers of these predatory, presumably u-social, xenomorphic aliens in check?

It would be an elegant twist in their story as a species as it seems the theme running with them is horrific parasitic infection in as many horrid ways and flavors as possible. I simply want to see natures ultimate law put to use; in the right environment every creature has a strength and downfall, everything is constantly checking and balancing each other (sometimes mercilessly). Yeah, you might call it namby pamby, cushy bottomed nature talk but I would like to see what kind brutal forces these creatures hail from, what afflictions they may have had in the beginning, and see what may naturally predate on them (Not yautja, you know what I mean by predate.)

I think a concept based on the workings of codyceps is just viciously creepy crawly enough to work with alien but I am certain there are WAY more ideas and concepts out there on what may be a nice addition to the aliens biology and history, some much better and probably just as inspired from our world as my concept of parasite fungi. I was to see more ideas on the subject of xenomorph origins.

For the hell of it I might draw out a concept work of the xeno fungus, maybe even write a short about it. Who knows, I might just get my head chewed off for posting this borderline Xeno hate tripe.

This is off topic, but Hunts_End what's the story behind your drawing? I see the city and dessert, where's its location, what's the Predator like, and if you could give me a deep explanation. Sorry if it sounds weird, but since I've seen it I've been generating all these scenarios in my head, I must know the truth!

Oh, eerm... Thanks for the interest in my signature doodle banner thingy PredAlienWarrior. Actually I've had the sketch for it lying around on my computer forever, I started drawing it with GIMP (photo manipulation/digital drawing program) a few years back. It doesn't actually have much to do with my activity here on avpuniverse. It was a frame from a short comic I sketched out pages for a long time ago and never finished. The predator was sent alongside what is presumably his father or other older male relative to a planet scantily populated by humans to perform his first solo hunt or something, while supervised by the aforementioned older male relative. It was supposed to be some thought provoking cryptic thing but ended up a clusterfuck of tangled plot holes and inaccuracies.

The planet was only scantily terraformed (It is possibly Mars or something) leaving it pretty plain and barren. Before filling in the sketch with line work and color the fence and sign hanging from it was supposed to be a warning that by crossing that fence one is exiting the area that is guaranteed to be atmospherically safe, I just stuck my user name there after finishing the color work. In the fan comic the idiot young blood gets himself into a jam by stupidly exiting the safe zone, then loosing his bio-helmet which earns him a nice firm reprimand from his supervising partner who has to go save his sorry skin. That is really about it and as far as I got doing it before I abandoned the idea.

^ Goddamn. That's pretty cool.